Post by Uttamasloka on Nov 28, 2013 15:27:04 GMT -5
This is an excerpt from my book, Chapter 1, The “origins of the jiva” debate – did we fall or not? I'm posting it here so I can directly link to it from FaceBook and other sites where this discussion often arises.
The subject of the spiritual origins of the souls – jivas – within the unlimited material universes is a very controversial issue within the Gaudiya Vaisnava community. The debate centers on whether the jiva was originally in a relationship with Krsna and engaged in pastimes (lila) in an eternal spiritual body, and then somehow or other “fell down” from Goloka (or Vaikuntha) into maya in the material world, versus the jiva not having been in Goloka (or Vaikuntha) originally.
In other words, the jivas never had an active spiritual form and identity, or a direct relationship with Krsna, and they are eternally conditioned (nitya-baddha) until they reach the platform of prema and thus, become qualified to participate in Krsna’s eternal pastimes.
The controversy exists primarily because there are a number of statements made by Srila Prabhupada which seem to imply that we were with Krsna originally, participating in His lila, but we left the spiritual world and forgot Him due to misuse of our independent free will. As such, many ISKCON devotees believe this is the truth.
In fact, Srila Prabhupada made many contradictory statements that appear to support both sides of the debate, such as:
After finishing their mock fighting, both the devotee and the Lord are again associated in the spiritual planets. That is very explicitly explained here. The conclusion is that no one falls from the spiritual world or Vaikuntha planets, for it is the eternal abode. SB, 3.16.26, Purport
Regarding your second question, have the conditioned souls ever seen Krsna? Were they with the Lord before being conditioned by the desire to lord it over material nature? Yes, the conditioned souls are parts and parcels of the Lord and thus, they were with Krsna before being conditioned. Just as the child must have seen his father because the father places the child in the womb of the mother, similarly each soul has seen Krsna or the Supreme Father. Letter to Jagadisha, Los Angeles, 4.25.70
Of course, a child in the womb doesn’t truly “know” who their father is, nor has that child actually “seen” their father. Such statements are thus neither conclusive, nor entirely selfevident. However, Srila Prabhupada did make several rather conclusive statements in his purports to Sri Isopanisad:
The all-pervading feature of the Lord-which exists in all circumstances of waking and sleeping as well as in potential states and from which the jiva-sakti (living force) is generated as both conditioned and liberated souls-is known as Brahman." SI, 16, Purport
As we have learned from previous mantras, the brahmajyoti emanating from the transcendental body of the Lord is full of spiritual sparks that are individual entities with the full sense of existence. Sometimes these living entities want to enjoy their senses, and therefore they are placed in the material world to become false lords under the dictation of the senses. SI, 17, Purport
There is nothing implied in these purports about a prior existence in Krsna’s lila. Quite the opposite. I’m not going to list all of Prabhupada’s statements and analyze each one. There is a more expeditious and instructional way to deal with this issue that will result in everyone’s greater understanding.
Because we know that Srila Prabhupada would never present any knowledge (tattva) or philosophical conclusions (siddhanta) that contradict the teachings of the previous acaryas, we have to resolve these apparent differences in a way that is harmonious with the previous acaryas’ statements, all of which are completely in sync on this subject. This will shed the necessary light to help us understand Srila Prabhupada’s statements within that broader authoritative context.
It is more pragmatic and advantageous to examine what the previous acaryas have stated, because they are the ultimate sources of Vaisnava philosophy and related sastric understanding, upon which Srila Prabhupada based his entire writings, as their faithful transparent representative. Apparent contradictions must be resolved by examining everyone’s relevant statements and deducing a coherent conclusion. That is the accepted process. Such conclusions will almost always then be self-evident.
I have yet to find one statement from any of the previous acaryas’ books or Vaisnava sastra, which directly indicates, or even remotely implies, that upon reaching full self-realization (prema-bhakti) one will “awaken” and/or “resume” one’s eternal relationship with Krsna from where they left off before falling from Goloka or Vaikuntha. Such statements do not exist in these texts. Quite the contrary in fact.
Bhaktivinoda Thakura explains the source of the nitya-baddha jivas in Jaiva-dharma, Chapters 15 and 16, which conclusively establishes the truth (tattva) of the jiva’s origins:
Vrajanatha: So maya has nothing whatever to do with creating the svarupa of the jivas – this has to be accepted. At the same time, I have also clearly understood that the jiva is by nature subject to the influence of maya. Now I want to know, did the cit-sakti create the jivas and give them their tatastha-svabhava (marginal nature)?
Babaji: No, the cit-sakti is paripurna-sakti, the complete potency of Krsna, and its manifestations are all eternally perfect substances. The jiva is not nitya-siddha, although when he performs sadhana, he can become sadhana-siddha and enjoy transcendental happiness like the nitya-siddhas, eternally perfect beings. JD, Chapter 15, Page 358
Jaiva-dharma, Chapter 16, Jivas Possessed by Maya:
Babaji: …Innumerable jivas appear from Sri Baladeva Prabhu to serve Vrndavana-vihari Sri Krsna as His eternal associates in Goloka Vrndavana, and others appear from Sri Sankarsana to serve the Lord of Vaikuntha, Sri Narayana, in the spiritual sky.
Eternally relishing rasa, engaged in the service of their worshipable Lord, they always remain fixed in their constitutional position. They always strive to please Bhagavan, and are always attentive to Him. Having attained the strength of cit-sakti, they are always strong.
They have no connection with the material energy. In fact, they do not know if there is a bewildering energy called maya or not. Because they reside in the spiritual world, maya is very far away from them and does not affect them at all.
Always absorbed in the bliss of serving their worshipable Lord, they are eternally liberated and are free from material happiness and distress. Their life is love alone, and they are not even conscious of misery, death or fear.
There are also innumerable, atomic, conscious jivas who emanate as rays in Karanodakasayi Maha-Visnu’s glance upon His maya-sakti. Because these jivas are situated next to maya, they perceive her wonderful workings.
Although they have all the qualities of the jivas that I have already described, because of their minute and marginal nature, they sometimes look to the spiritual world, and sometimes to the material world. In this marginal condition, the jiva is very weak because at that time he has not attained spiritual strength from the mercy of the object of his worship (seva-vastu).
Among these unlimited jivas, those who want to enjoy maya become engrossed in mundane sense gratification and enter the state of nitya-baddha. On the other hand, the jivas who perform cid-anusilanam of Bhagavan receive spiritual sakti (cid-bala) by His mercy, and enter the spiritual world. JD, Chapter 16, Page 377-378
Bhaktivinoda Thakura thus dispels all doubts and confusion. The jivas in the material world have originally emanated from Maha-Visnu, as part of the marginal potency (tatastha-sakti), and some of them go directly to the spiritual realm, whereas others go directly to the material world.
Bhaktivinoda Thakura wrote more on this subject in those two chapters, which expand greatly on these truths. Many other questions are answered there, such as:
Vrajanatha: Prabhu, I understand that this marginal position is situated in tatastha-svabhava, or the junction, of the spiritual and material worlds. Why is it that some jivas go from there to the material world, while others go to the spiritual world?
Vrajanatha: Krsna is karunamaya (full of mercy), so why did He make the jiva so weak that he became entangled in maya?
Vrajanatha: Why must the jivas suffer for the sake of Bhagavan’s pastimes?
Vrajanatha: What harm would there have been if the jiva had not been given independent desire? Krsna is omniscient, and He gave this independence to the jivas, even though He knew that they would suffer on account of it, so isn’t He responsible for the jiva’s suffering?
Vrajanatha: Is maya-sakti the cause of our misfortune then? Would the jivas have had to suffer like this if the omnipotent and omniscient Sri Krsna had kept maya away from them?
I decided not to quote the entire lengthy section above from Jaiva-dharma, because it is beyond the scope of this book to delve into the those topics in that much detail, but a sample has been given to bring attention to the knowledge available on this subject. Rest assured that none of the answers to those questions has anything to do with the jivas waking up and reactivating their original spiritual body, or re-engaging in the lila where they left off. All Gaudiya Vaisnavas should carefully and thoroughly study Jaiva-dharma.
Every single description from the acaryas’ writings about a devotee’s entry into Krsna’s eternal pastimes (nitya-lila) indicates a new beginning, including first taking birth from a Vraja gopi in Krsna’s earthly pastimes (bhauma-lila), where the jiva obtains the necessary social context (abhimana) for their “new” identity – parents, siblings, husband, village of birth, social status, and so on. As we will learn, it is in that final birth that the realized jivas perfect the higher stages of their prema, thus becoming fully qualified to enter the eternal pastimes in Goloka in the transcendental realm (aprakata-nitya-lila).
If we are simply resuming our original relationship from where we left off, then what is the need for taking birth again in the lila if we supposedly already existed there before? Or what is the need for further training and development under the guidance of a Vraja associate as is always recommended? If we are just “waking up from being asleep in maya” why wouldn’t we just pick up where we left off in the same condition as when we left, fully reinstated in our original situation and fully conscious of our previous identity, relationship and service?
In Krsna Book, Srila Prabhupada also confirms the truth of a new beginning:
The mature devotees, who have completely executed Krsna consciousness, are immediately transferred to the universe where Krsna is appearing. In that universe the devotees get their first opportunity to associate with Krsna personally and directly. KB, Chapter 28, 6th paragraph
In Raga-vartma-candrika, Second Diffusion, Visvanatha Cakravarti provides these illuminating details:
One may ask, “Why don’t you say that when the sadhaka attains the stage of prema and leaves his body, he will take a gopika body in the spiritual world without taking birth from the womb of a gopika, after which he manifests sneha and so on (i.e., the higher stages of prema), in that body through the association of the eternally perfect gopis?”
The answer here is: No, that will not happen, because then one cannot get a harmonious acquaintance according to the human-like pastimes there, like: ‘Whose daughter is this sakhi? Whose wife is she? Whose daughter-in-law is she?’
‘Alright then’ one may say, ‘then what is the harm in taking birth in the aprakata lila?’ Then the answer is no, that also cannot be. Sadhakas or materially conditioned souls cannot enter into the transcendental manifestation named Sri Vrndavana Dhama. Only perfected souls can enter it. Even through one’s own sadhana the moods of sneha and so on are not easily attained.
Therefore, those devotees for whom yogamaya, for the sake of perfecting their moods like sneha and so on, arranges that prema is manifest in them after they take birth in Krsna’s materially manifest pastimes (bhauma-lila) in Sri Vrndavana Dhama, and before they attain Krsna’s bodily association, they are taken to Krsna’s materially manifest pastimes in Vrndavana. Because practicing devotees, karmis and perfected devotees can all be seen to enter into the materially manifest Sri Vrndavana Dhama, it is experienced as both sadhaka bhumi and siddha bhumi.
Then if you say, “Where will those most eager sadhakas stay after they attain prema and until they attain a gopika body, after leaving their material bodies?”
Then I answer: “After the sadhaka body perishes, that loving devotee, who has eagerly desired direct devotional service for a long time, will at once, by the Lord’s grace, receive the gift of the desired service and the audience of the Lord and His eternal associates, just as He once bestowed direct audience to Narada Muni.”
He (Krsna) will give the sadhaka a transcendental gopika body. Yogamaya will make that body take birth from a gopika mother in the manifest pastimes when Krsna descends to earth with His eternal associates. There will not be a second delay in that because the prakata-lila goes on without interruption. He will take birth in that material universe where Krsna plays His manifest Vrndavana lila at that time. Krsna and His associates appear when the loving practicing devotee leaves his body. RVC, 2.7
This lucid explanation by Visvanatha Cakravarti cannot possibly be construed in any way other than being a clear indication that there was no original relationship that is being resumed upon achieving bhava. Where are the statements or stories that describe your mother, father and friends welcoming you back to Goloka, and asking where have you been and why did you leave? There are none anywhere in Vaisnava literature. Zero.
Srila Prabhupada made many statements about the jivas ‘waking up’ from the material dream (illusion), but this also does not conflict with the previous acaryas’ teachings, nor does it directly confirm a previously active lila-based relationship with Krsna. It simply describes the covering and deluding nature of maya’s illusion, as well as a way to conceptualize spiritual enlightenment.
Bhaktivinoda Thakura clarifies the ‘dreaming’ concept in Jaiva-dharma by quoting sastra:
There are two positions about which the jiva-purusa should inquire – the inanimate material world, and the spiritual world. The jiva is situated in a third position, which is a dreamlike condition, and is the juncture (tatastha) between the other two. Being situated at the place where the two worlds meet, he sees both the jada-jagat (inert world) and the cid-jagat (spiritual world). Brhad-aranyaka Upanisad (4.3.9)
Just as a large fish in a river sometimes goes to the eastern bank and sometimes to the western bank, so the jiva, being situated in karana-jala (the water of cause that lies between the inert and conscious worlds), also gradually wanders to both banks, the place of dreaming and the place of wakefulness. Brhad-aranyaka Upanisad (4.3.18) JD, Chapter 15, Jiva Tattva, Page 355
Based on the evidence presented in the above statements, there is no possible conclusion to be reached other than to understand that Srila Prabhupada’s statements were his attempts to explain complex philosophical truths (jiva tattva) to people who were raised in the deepest levels of ignorance and illusion, without any background in basic Vedic knowledge. Added to that, his primary audiences were generally very young, immature individuals with no seasoned wisdom, with deep dysfunctional conditioning from perverted dogmatic religious and degraded (by Vedic standards) social backgrounds.
Another aspect to consider is that there are literally trillions and trillions of jivas in all of the uncountable universes manifested from Maha-Visnu’s breathing. Are we to believe that so many jivas fell from Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrndavana, and continue to regularly fall?
And are we supposed to believe that all of the nitya-siddhas in the transcendental realm can potentially fall from that realm? Everyone is at risk? If not, where do you draw the line between those who are at risk of falling versus those who aren’t? Isn’t everyone in that realm eternally liberated (nitya-siddha)?
Where are those verses to confirm these concepts? There are none. What kind of transcendental eternal realms are Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrndavana if so many jivas can fall out of love with Krsna and descend from such exalted abodes, from which no one is ever supposed to leave? Again, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, because it is not the truth.
The material sphere of Krsna’s creation is said to be approximately one quarter (ekapada vibhuti) of His entire creation, of which the spiritual realms are the remaining three quarters (tripada vibhuti). So are we to understand that roughly 25% of all jivas became disenchanted with being in the perfect spiritual realms with Krsna and thought there might be something better than that?
Someone (supposedly trillions of jivas) thought that being a gopi lover of Krsna wasn’t good enough, let’s see what else is going on over there in the material world? How can that possibly happen? The vraja-vasis don’t even know about the existence of the material realms, what to speak of coming in contact with them or contemplating them.
In Priti-sandarbha, Jiva Gosvami explains how and when new souls enter the material universe:
“Kalpa after kalpa the number of individual souls in the material world remains the same. Do the individual souls never attain liberation? O knower of religion, I ask you what is the reason for this.
“One by one, kalpa after kalpa, the individual souls attain liberation. O brahmana, would not the material World become gradually empty in the course of time?” To this question, Sri Markandeya gave this answer:
“When one individual soul attains liberation, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who has inconceivable potencies, replaces him by creating another soul. In this way the Lord keeps the material world always filled.
“The souls who reside on Brahmaloka attain liberation along with the demigod Brahma. When, in the next maha-kalpa, the material worlds are created again, these souls are replaced with other souls like them.” Visnu-dharma Purana, Uttara-khanda, quoted in PS, Anuccheda 16
What possible argument could defeat those facts? And how do you explain why it is that if we return to Vaikuntha or Goloka this time, we are guaranteed never to fall down again? If we fell the first time, why wouldn’t it be possible to fall again? What happened to that guarantee the first time? Does it only apply the second time around?
When one practices vaidhi-bhakti, one can attain prema and go to Vaikuntha, where one can acquire four types of liberation: living on the same planet as Visnu (salokya), having the same bodily form as Visnu (sarupya,), having the same opulence as Visnu (sarsti,), and having constant association with Visnu (samipya).
If a liberated Vaisnava has the choice to “attain a bodily form like Visnu” - sarupya-mukti - then where is the question of returning home and waking up your original existing spiritual body? This is further proof that one’s spiritual bodily form is “awarded” to the jiva by Krsna or Visnu according to one’s desires to serve in a specific capacity.
From Brhad-bhagavatamrta, Second Canto:
Sri Ganesa said: These are associates of the ruler of Vaikuntha, the Supreme Lord Sri Krsna. They have attained bodily forms similar to His (sarupya) and have come here from Vaikuntha itself. BB, 2.3.85
As I reverently offered obeisances, those associates of the Lord embraced me and reassured me again and again. Putting forward hundreds of arguments, they wished to give me a bodily form like theirs. BB, 2.4.13
Sanatana Gosvami’s commentary:
The associates of Narayana assured Gopa-kumara that he need not be so surprised and should not treat them with such reverence. They were his friends, they told him, and were now bringing him to Vaikuntha. They furthermore tried to convince him to accept a Vaikuntha body like theirs, with four arms. His human body, they argued, was not suitable for living in Vaikuntha; it would not be adequate for fully enjoying Vaikuntha life.
They have assumed forms with colors and shapes similar to those of the Lord they have worshiped as most dear. BB, 2.4.141
Sanatana Gosvami’s commentary:
This verse indicates that Vaikuntha devotees who appear in nonhuman forms, such as those of some animal or plant, have worshiped similar forms of Lord Narayana, who by His expansion appeared in those same species. These devotees, each in his own way, have realized the perfection of sarupya, having attained forms that look just like those of the Supreme Lord.
Jiva Gosvami explains the same thing in Priti-sandarbha:
“By service of the Absolute Truth, even for a few days, a devotee attains firm and fixed intelligence in Me. Consequently he goes to become My associate in the transcendental world after giving up the present deplorable material worlds.”
In Srimad-bhagavatam 1.6.28, the Supreme Personality of Godhead promises to give the devotee a spiritual form like His own. Here “tam bhagavatim” means, “a form that is a fragment of the spiritual effulgence of the Supreme Lord”, “suddham” means, “untouched by matter”, “tanum” means “a form given by the Supreme Personality of Godhead”, and “mayi prayujyamane” means, “attained by me when the results of karma came to an end”.
This happened when the material body made of five elements fell away. Here it is seen that the subtle material body of mind, intelligence, and false ego is also destroyed. Because of his faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the devotee’s past karma also comes to an end. PS, Anuccheda 11
Once again, irrefutable statements that cannot be interpreted in any other way. And the same is true for raganuga-bhaktas who attain spiritual bodies of gopas and gopis. Those bodies are “awarded” to sadhana-siddha jivas exactly according to their desires for a specific relationship with Krsna in their chosen mood of love. Here is a vivid example of this from Brhadbhagavatamrta, where Sarupa (Gopa-kumara) and his disciple Sri Janasarma (the Mathura brahmana) meet Krsna in Goloka:
Lord Krsna, that crest jewel of munificent persons, was distressed because He could not find anything better than Himself to offer as a gift. So He removed the ornaments from His own body and decorated the brahmana with them, making him look like Sarupa. BB, 2.7.42
Sanatana Gosvami’s commentary:
“This learned brahmana has offered Me his very self,” Krsna thought, “but in return I must give him something more valuable than My self; otherwise I won’t be showing any more generosity than I normally do. But I can’t find anything more precious than My self. What can I give him?” Thinking like this made Krsna anxious.
He then decided to give Janasarma something He had never before given to anyone – His own ornaments. But Krsna had to consider seriously before He made that decision, because to give such a gift would verify that He considers His devotees more important than Himself. Along with His ornaments, Krsna also gave Janasarma a cowherd’s form similar to Sarupa’s.
In this way Krsna bestowed on Janasarma a supreme mercy that only He could give. And Janasarma felt completely fulfilled. BB, 2.7.43
From Sanatana Gosvami’s commentary:
By converting the dry brahmana Janasarma into a young cowherd fit to join the assembly of intimate cowherd friends, Krsna proved that in giving mercy He is unsurpassed. And Janasarma, having attained a form like his own guru’s, was fully satisfied.
These statements are conclusive beyond any arguments. Many additional references from all of the acaryas will be given in later chapters to further validate this absolute fact. Here is one more vivid example from Visvanatha Cakravarti’s commentary in Ujjvala-nilamani. He begins by posing a question:
“If those present day persons practicing raganuga attain prema in some birth by going through the states of nistha, ruci, and asakti, they become qualified for service to the Lord. At the time of leaving the body, will they attain the positions of associates beyond the material world, or participate when the Lord descends as an avatara?”
Because it is impossible for the transformations of prema such as sneha, mana, pranaya to appear in the body of a sadhaka, by the power of associating in gopi bodies with nitya-siddha gopis having mahabhava, and by seeing, hearing, remembering and chanting about the qualities of the Lord, they will certainly attain such a position. Because these methods are very powerful, without them one cannot attain perfection as a gopi.
He (Krsna) gives a spiritual gopi body endowed with proper bhavas, as he gave a spiritual body to Narada. Then, when Krsna and his associates appear in a manifest Vrndavana, that body is born in the womb of a gopi by the arrangement of yogamaya in order to perfect sneha and other varieties of prema. UN, 3.49-51 Commentary
Krsna “gives a spiritual gopi body,” … “as He gave a spiritual body to Narada.” Why does Krsna have to give a spiritual body if we already had one that was simply asleep? Krsna “gave” Narada a spiritual body – it doesn’t say that Krsna woke him up or showed him his original form that was dormant. Where are the verses which say that Krsna wakes up the devotee so they can see their original spiritual form? There are none.
And finally, Sanatana Gosvami comments in Brhad-bhagavatamrta:
A non devotee may ask, “Because devotional service is a type of activity and all activities are driven by ego, how can devotional service develop after ego has been left aside?” This question comes from a misunderstanding of the Supreme Lord’s personal energies. Just as one of His special energies provides liberated Vaisnavas with spiritual bodies, another gives them a transcendental ego, with the attitude that “I am His servant.” With this spiritual ego, pure devotional service is easily obtained. BB, 2.2.208 commentary
How can anyone possibly interpret these statements to support the argument that we fell from Vraja or Vaikuntha, and through bhakti, we’re simply waking up to resume our forgotten rasa with Krsna in our original spiritual bodies, which already exist? It cannot be done.
We cannot resolve this issue by limiting our study to Srila Prabhupada’s statements only, while ignoring the statements of the acaryas as presented above. Any authoritative analysis must include the entire body of Gaudiya Vaisnava literature. Therefore, those who assert the fall theory must explain all of the statements presented herein to prove that they confirm their theory.
According to the parampara protocol, we are obligated to defer to the collective, unified consensus presented by all of the previous acaryas, and resolve Srila Prabhupada’s statements according to their conclusions. Twisting Srila Prabhupada’s statements to force them to prove that the jivas fell from Krsna’s lila, against an overwhelming abundance of contrary evidence is a futile exercise, as examining any of the weak contrary arguments will easily reveal.
What is the purpose of trying to prove that Srila Prabhupada said something so contradictory to the previous acaryas? Their numerous statements are clear and indisputable, and there is not one single statement that supports the “fall from the lila” side of this debate. To maintain and promote that Srila Prabhupada established this false concept is not loyalty to Srila Prabhupada, it is guru-aparadha because it is a serious distortion of his statements and Vaisnava siddhanta. It reveals a complete lack of understanding of this crucial philosophical subject. It should be rejected by all of his disciples and followers.
The subject of the spiritual origins of the souls – jivas – within the unlimited material universes is a very controversial issue within the Gaudiya Vaisnava community. The debate centers on whether the jiva was originally in a relationship with Krsna and engaged in pastimes (lila) in an eternal spiritual body, and then somehow or other “fell down” from Goloka (or Vaikuntha) into maya in the material world, versus the jiva not having been in Goloka (or Vaikuntha) originally.
In other words, the jivas never had an active spiritual form and identity, or a direct relationship with Krsna, and they are eternally conditioned (nitya-baddha) until they reach the platform of prema and thus, become qualified to participate in Krsna’s eternal pastimes.
The controversy exists primarily because there are a number of statements made by Srila Prabhupada which seem to imply that we were with Krsna originally, participating in His lila, but we left the spiritual world and forgot Him due to misuse of our independent free will. As such, many ISKCON devotees believe this is the truth.
In fact, Srila Prabhupada made many contradictory statements that appear to support both sides of the debate, such as:
After finishing their mock fighting, both the devotee and the Lord are again associated in the spiritual planets. That is very explicitly explained here. The conclusion is that no one falls from the spiritual world or Vaikuntha planets, for it is the eternal abode. SB, 3.16.26, Purport
Regarding your second question, have the conditioned souls ever seen Krsna? Were they with the Lord before being conditioned by the desire to lord it over material nature? Yes, the conditioned souls are parts and parcels of the Lord and thus, they were with Krsna before being conditioned. Just as the child must have seen his father because the father places the child in the womb of the mother, similarly each soul has seen Krsna or the Supreme Father. Letter to Jagadisha, Los Angeles, 4.25.70
Of course, a child in the womb doesn’t truly “know” who their father is, nor has that child actually “seen” their father. Such statements are thus neither conclusive, nor entirely selfevident. However, Srila Prabhupada did make several rather conclusive statements in his purports to Sri Isopanisad:
The all-pervading feature of the Lord-which exists in all circumstances of waking and sleeping as well as in potential states and from which the jiva-sakti (living force) is generated as both conditioned and liberated souls-is known as Brahman." SI, 16, Purport
As we have learned from previous mantras, the brahmajyoti emanating from the transcendental body of the Lord is full of spiritual sparks that are individual entities with the full sense of existence. Sometimes these living entities want to enjoy their senses, and therefore they are placed in the material world to become false lords under the dictation of the senses. SI, 17, Purport
There is nothing implied in these purports about a prior existence in Krsna’s lila. Quite the opposite. I’m not going to list all of Prabhupada’s statements and analyze each one. There is a more expeditious and instructional way to deal with this issue that will result in everyone’s greater understanding.
Because we know that Srila Prabhupada would never present any knowledge (tattva) or philosophical conclusions (siddhanta) that contradict the teachings of the previous acaryas, we have to resolve these apparent differences in a way that is harmonious with the previous acaryas’ statements, all of which are completely in sync on this subject. This will shed the necessary light to help us understand Srila Prabhupada’s statements within that broader authoritative context.
It is more pragmatic and advantageous to examine what the previous acaryas have stated, because they are the ultimate sources of Vaisnava philosophy and related sastric understanding, upon which Srila Prabhupada based his entire writings, as their faithful transparent representative. Apparent contradictions must be resolved by examining everyone’s relevant statements and deducing a coherent conclusion. That is the accepted process. Such conclusions will almost always then be self-evident.
I have yet to find one statement from any of the previous acaryas’ books or Vaisnava sastra, which directly indicates, or even remotely implies, that upon reaching full self-realization (prema-bhakti) one will “awaken” and/or “resume” one’s eternal relationship with Krsna from where they left off before falling from Goloka or Vaikuntha. Such statements do not exist in these texts. Quite the contrary in fact.
Bhaktivinoda Thakura explains the source of the nitya-baddha jivas in Jaiva-dharma, Chapters 15 and 16, which conclusively establishes the truth (tattva) of the jiva’s origins:
Vrajanatha: So maya has nothing whatever to do with creating the svarupa of the jivas – this has to be accepted. At the same time, I have also clearly understood that the jiva is by nature subject to the influence of maya. Now I want to know, did the cit-sakti create the jivas and give them their tatastha-svabhava (marginal nature)?
Babaji: No, the cit-sakti is paripurna-sakti, the complete potency of Krsna, and its manifestations are all eternally perfect substances. The jiva is not nitya-siddha, although when he performs sadhana, he can become sadhana-siddha and enjoy transcendental happiness like the nitya-siddhas, eternally perfect beings. JD, Chapter 15, Page 358
Jaiva-dharma, Chapter 16, Jivas Possessed by Maya:
Babaji: …Innumerable jivas appear from Sri Baladeva Prabhu to serve Vrndavana-vihari Sri Krsna as His eternal associates in Goloka Vrndavana, and others appear from Sri Sankarsana to serve the Lord of Vaikuntha, Sri Narayana, in the spiritual sky.
Eternally relishing rasa, engaged in the service of their worshipable Lord, they always remain fixed in their constitutional position. They always strive to please Bhagavan, and are always attentive to Him. Having attained the strength of cit-sakti, they are always strong.
They have no connection with the material energy. In fact, they do not know if there is a bewildering energy called maya or not. Because they reside in the spiritual world, maya is very far away from them and does not affect them at all.
Always absorbed in the bliss of serving their worshipable Lord, they are eternally liberated and are free from material happiness and distress. Their life is love alone, and they are not even conscious of misery, death or fear.
There are also innumerable, atomic, conscious jivas who emanate as rays in Karanodakasayi Maha-Visnu’s glance upon His maya-sakti. Because these jivas are situated next to maya, they perceive her wonderful workings.
Although they have all the qualities of the jivas that I have already described, because of their minute and marginal nature, they sometimes look to the spiritual world, and sometimes to the material world. In this marginal condition, the jiva is very weak because at that time he has not attained spiritual strength from the mercy of the object of his worship (seva-vastu).
Among these unlimited jivas, those who want to enjoy maya become engrossed in mundane sense gratification and enter the state of nitya-baddha. On the other hand, the jivas who perform cid-anusilanam of Bhagavan receive spiritual sakti (cid-bala) by His mercy, and enter the spiritual world. JD, Chapter 16, Page 377-378
Bhaktivinoda Thakura thus dispels all doubts and confusion. The jivas in the material world have originally emanated from Maha-Visnu, as part of the marginal potency (tatastha-sakti), and some of them go directly to the spiritual realm, whereas others go directly to the material world.
Bhaktivinoda Thakura wrote more on this subject in those two chapters, which expand greatly on these truths. Many other questions are answered there, such as:
Vrajanatha: Prabhu, I understand that this marginal position is situated in tatastha-svabhava, or the junction, of the spiritual and material worlds. Why is it that some jivas go from there to the material world, while others go to the spiritual world?
Vrajanatha: Krsna is karunamaya (full of mercy), so why did He make the jiva so weak that he became entangled in maya?
Vrajanatha: Why must the jivas suffer for the sake of Bhagavan’s pastimes?
Vrajanatha: What harm would there have been if the jiva had not been given independent desire? Krsna is omniscient, and He gave this independence to the jivas, even though He knew that they would suffer on account of it, so isn’t He responsible for the jiva’s suffering?
Vrajanatha: Is maya-sakti the cause of our misfortune then? Would the jivas have had to suffer like this if the omnipotent and omniscient Sri Krsna had kept maya away from them?
I decided not to quote the entire lengthy section above from Jaiva-dharma, because it is beyond the scope of this book to delve into the those topics in that much detail, but a sample has been given to bring attention to the knowledge available on this subject. Rest assured that none of the answers to those questions has anything to do with the jivas waking up and reactivating their original spiritual body, or re-engaging in the lila where they left off. All Gaudiya Vaisnavas should carefully and thoroughly study Jaiva-dharma.
Every single description from the acaryas’ writings about a devotee’s entry into Krsna’s eternal pastimes (nitya-lila) indicates a new beginning, including first taking birth from a Vraja gopi in Krsna’s earthly pastimes (bhauma-lila), where the jiva obtains the necessary social context (abhimana) for their “new” identity – parents, siblings, husband, village of birth, social status, and so on. As we will learn, it is in that final birth that the realized jivas perfect the higher stages of their prema, thus becoming fully qualified to enter the eternal pastimes in Goloka in the transcendental realm (aprakata-nitya-lila).
If we are simply resuming our original relationship from where we left off, then what is the need for taking birth again in the lila if we supposedly already existed there before? Or what is the need for further training and development under the guidance of a Vraja associate as is always recommended? If we are just “waking up from being asleep in maya” why wouldn’t we just pick up where we left off in the same condition as when we left, fully reinstated in our original situation and fully conscious of our previous identity, relationship and service?
In Krsna Book, Srila Prabhupada also confirms the truth of a new beginning:
The mature devotees, who have completely executed Krsna consciousness, are immediately transferred to the universe where Krsna is appearing. In that universe the devotees get their first opportunity to associate with Krsna personally and directly. KB, Chapter 28, 6th paragraph
In Raga-vartma-candrika, Second Diffusion, Visvanatha Cakravarti provides these illuminating details:
One may ask, “Why don’t you say that when the sadhaka attains the stage of prema and leaves his body, he will take a gopika body in the spiritual world without taking birth from the womb of a gopika, after which he manifests sneha and so on (i.e., the higher stages of prema), in that body through the association of the eternally perfect gopis?”
The answer here is: No, that will not happen, because then one cannot get a harmonious acquaintance according to the human-like pastimes there, like: ‘Whose daughter is this sakhi? Whose wife is she? Whose daughter-in-law is she?’
‘Alright then’ one may say, ‘then what is the harm in taking birth in the aprakata lila?’ Then the answer is no, that also cannot be. Sadhakas or materially conditioned souls cannot enter into the transcendental manifestation named Sri Vrndavana Dhama. Only perfected souls can enter it. Even through one’s own sadhana the moods of sneha and so on are not easily attained.
Therefore, those devotees for whom yogamaya, for the sake of perfecting their moods like sneha and so on, arranges that prema is manifest in them after they take birth in Krsna’s materially manifest pastimes (bhauma-lila) in Sri Vrndavana Dhama, and before they attain Krsna’s bodily association, they are taken to Krsna’s materially manifest pastimes in Vrndavana. Because practicing devotees, karmis and perfected devotees can all be seen to enter into the materially manifest Sri Vrndavana Dhama, it is experienced as both sadhaka bhumi and siddha bhumi.
Then if you say, “Where will those most eager sadhakas stay after they attain prema and until they attain a gopika body, after leaving their material bodies?”
Then I answer: “After the sadhaka body perishes, that loving devotee, who has eagerly desired direct devotional service for a long time, will at once, by the Lord’s grace, receive the gift of the desired service and the audience of the Lord and His eternal associates, just as He once bestowed direct audience to Narada Muni.”
He (Krsna) will give the sadhaka a transcendental gopika body. Yogamaya will make that body take birth from a gopika mother in the manifest pastimes when Krsna descends to earth with His eternal associates. There will not be a second delay in that because the prakata-lila goes on without interruption. He will take birth in that material universe where Krsna plays His manifest Vrndavana lila at that time. Krsna and His associates appear when the loving practicing devotee leaves his body. RVC, 2.7
This lucid explanation by Visvanatha Cakravarti cannot possibly be construed in any way other than being a clear indication that there was no original relationship that is being resumed upon achieving bhava. Where are the statements or stories that describe your mother, father and friends welcoming you back to Goloka, and asking where have you been and why did you leave? There are none anywhere in Vaisnava literature. Zero.
Srila Prabhupada made many statements about the jivas ‘waking up’ from the material dream (illusion), but this also does not conflict with the previous acaryas’ teachings, nor does it directly confirm a previously active lila-based relationship with Krsna. It simply describes the covering and deluding nature of maya’s illusion, as well as a way to conceptualize spiritual enlightenment.
Bhaktivinoda Thakura clarifies the ‘dreaming’ concept in Jaiva-dharma by quoting sastra:
There are two positions about which the jiva-purusa should inquire – the inanimate material world, and the spiritual world. The jiva is situated in a third position, which is a dreamlike condition, and is the juncture (tatastha) between the other two. Being situated at the place where the two worlds meet, he sees both the jada-jagat (inert world) and the cid-jagat (spiritual world). Brhad-aranyaka Upanisad (4.3.9)
Just as a large fish in a river sometimes goes to the eastern bank and sometimes to the western bank, so the jiva, being situated in karana-jala (the water of cause that lies between the inert and conscious worlds), also gradually wanders to both banks, the place of dreaming and the place of wakefulness. Brhad-aranyaka Upanisad (4.3.18) JD, Chapter 15, Jiva Tattva, Page 355
Based on the evidence presented in the above statements, there is no possible conclusion to be reached other than to understand that Srila Prabhupada’s statements were his attempts to explain complex philosophical truths (jiva tattva) to people who were raised in the deepest levels of ignorance and illusion, without any background in basic Vedic knowledge. Added to that, his primary audiences were generally very young, immature individuals with no seasoned wisdom, with deep dysfunctional conditioning from perverted dogmatic religious and degraded (by Vedic standards) social backgrounds.
Another aspect to consider is that there are literally trillions and trillions of jivas in all of the uncountable universes manifested from Maha-Visnu’s breathing. Are we to believe that so many jivas fell from Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrndavana, and continue to regularly fall?
And are we supposed to believe that all of the nitya-siddhas in the transcendental realm can potentially fall from that realm? Everyone is at risk? If not, where do you draw the line between those who are at risk of falling versus those who aren’t? Isn’t everyone in that realm eternally liberated (nitya-siddha)?
Where are those verses to confirm these concepts? There are none. What kind of transcendental eternal realms are Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrndavana if so many jivas can fall out of love with Krsna and descend from such exalted abodes, from which no one is ever supposed to leave? Again, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, because it is not the truth.
The material sphere of Krsna’s creation is said to be approximately one quarter (ekapada vibhuti) of His entire creation, of which the spiritual realms are the remaining three quarters (tripada vibhuti). So are we to understand that roughly 25% of all jivas became disenchanted with being in the perfect spiritual realms with Krsna and thought there might be something better than that?
Someone (supposedly trillions of jivas) thought that being a gopi lover of Krsna wasn’t good enough, let’s see what else is going on over there in the material world? How can that possibly happen? The vraja-vasis don’t even know about the existence of the material realms, what to speak of coming in contact with them or contemplating them.
In Priti-sandarbha, Jiva Gosvami explains how and when new souls enter the material universe:
“Kalpa after kalpa the number of individual souls in the material world remains the same. Do the individual souls never attain liberation? O knower of religion, I ask you what is the reason for this.
“One by one, kalpa after kalpa, the individual souls attain liberation. O brahmana, would not the material World become gradually empty in the course of time?” To this question, Sri Markandeya gave this answer:
“When one individual soul attains liberation, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, who has inconceivable potencies, replaces him by creating another soul. In this way the Lord keeps the material world always filled.
“The souls who reside on Brahmaloka attain liberation along with the demigod Brahma. When, in the next maha-kalpa, the material worlds are created again, these souls are replaced with other souls like them.” Visnu-dharma Purana, Uttara-khanda, quoted in PS, Anuccheda 16
What possible argument could defeat those facts? And how do you explain why it is that if we return to Vaikuntha or Goloka this time, we are guaranteed never to fall down again? If we fell the first time, why wouldn’t it be possible to fall again? What happened to that guarantee the first time? Does it only apply the second time around?
When one practices vaidhi-bhakti, one can attain prema and go to Vaikuntha, where one can acquire four types of liberation: living on the same planet as Visnu (salokya), having the same bodily form as Visnu (sarupya,), having the same opulence as Visnu (sarsti,), and having constant association with Visnu (samipya).
If a liberated Vaisnava has the choice to “attain a bodily form like Visnu” - sarupya-mukti - then where is the question of returning home and waking up your original existing spiritual body? This is further proof that one’s spiritual bodily form is “awarded” to the jiva by Krsna or Visnu according to one’s desires to serve in a specific capacity.
From Brhad-bhagavatamrta, Second Canto:
Sri Ganesa said: These are associates of the ruler of Vaikuntha, the Supreme Lord Sri Krsna. They have attained bodily forms similar to His (sarupya) and have come here from Vaikuntha itself. BB, 2.3.85
As I reverently offered obeisances, those associates of the Lord embraced me and reassured me again and again. Putting forward hundreds of arguments, they wished to give me a bodily form like theirs. BB, 2.4.13
Sanatana Gosvami’s commentary:
The associates of Narayana assured Gopa-kumara that he need not be so surprised and should not treat them with such reverence. They were his friends, they told him, and were now bringing him to Vaikuntha. They furthermore tried to convince him to accept a Vaikuntha body like theirs, with four arms. His human body, they argued, was not suitable for living in Vaikuntha; it would not be adequate for fully enjoying Vaikuntha life.
They have assumed forms with colors and shapes similar to those of the Lord they have worshiped as most dear. BB, 2.4.141
Sanatana Gosvami’s commentary:
This verse indicates that Vaikuntha devotees who appear in nonhuman forms, such as those of some animal or plant, have worshiped similar forms of Lord Narayana, who by His expansion appeared in those same species. These devotees, each in his own way, have realized the perfection of sarupya, having attained forms that look just like those of the Supreme Lord.
Jiva Gosvami explains the same thing in Priti-sandarbha:
“By service of the Absolute Truth, even for a few days, a devotee attains firm and fixed intelligence in Me. Consequently he goes to become My associate in the transcendental world after giving up the present deplorable material worlds.”
In Srimad-bhagavatam 1.6.28, the Supreme Personality of Godhead promises to give the devotee a spiritual form like His own. Here “tam bhagavatim” means, “a form that is a fragment of the spiritual effulgence of the Supreme Lord”, “suddham” means, “untouched by matter”, “tanum” means “a form given by the Supreme Personality of Godhead”, and “mayi prayujyamane” means, “attained by me when the results of karma came to an end”.
This happened when the material body made of five elements fell away. Here it is seen that the subtle material body of mind, intelligence, and false ego is also destroyed. Because of his faith in the Supreme Personality of Godhead, the devotee’s past karma also comes to an end. PS, Anuccheda 11
Once again, irrefutable statements that cannot be interpreted in any other way. And the same is true for raganuga-bhaktas who attain spiritual bodies of gopas and gopis. Those bodies are “awarded” to sadhana-siddha jivas exactly according to their desires for a specific relationship with Krsna in their chosen mood of love. Here is a vivid example of this from Brhadbhagavatamrta, where Sarupa (Gopa-kumara) and his disciple Sri Janasarma (the Mathura brahmana) meet Krsna in Goloka:
Lord Krsna, that crest jewel of munificent persons, was distressed because He could not find anything better than Himself to offer as a gift. So He removed the ornaments from His own body and decorated the brahmana with them, making him look like Sarupa. BB, 2.7.42
Sanatana Gosvami’s commentary:
“This learned brahmana has offered Me his very self,” Krsna thought, “but in return I must give him something more valuable than My self; otherwise I won’t be showing any more generosity than I normally do. But I can’t find anything more precious than My self. What can I give him?” Thinking like this made Krsna anxious.
He then decided to give Janasarma something He had never before given to anyone – His own ornaments. But Krsna had to consider seriously before He made that decision, because to give such a gift would verify that He considers His devotees more important than Himself. Along with His ornaments, Krsna also gave Janasarma a cowherd’s form similar to Sarupa’s.
In this way Krsna bestowed on Janasarma a supreme mercy that only He could give. And Janasarma felt completely fulfilled. BB, 2.7.43
From Sanatana Gosvami’s commentary:
By converting the dry brahmana Janasarma into a young cowherd fit to join the assembly of intimate cowherd friends, Krsna proved that in giving mercy He is unsurpassed. And Janasarma, having attained a form like his own guru’s, was fully satisfied.
These statements are conclusive beyond any arguments. Many additional references from all of the acaryas will be given in later chapters to further validate this absolute fact. Here is one more vivid example from Visvanatha Cakravarti’s commentary in Ujjvala-nilamani. He begins by posing a question:
“If those present day persons practicing raganuga attain prema in some birth by going through the states of nistha, ruci, and asakti, they become qualified for service to the Lord. At the time of leaving the body, will they attain the positions of associates beyond the material world, or participate when the Lord descends as an avatara?”
Because it is impossible for the transformations of prema such as sneha, mana, pranaya to appear in the body of a sadhaka, by the power of associating in gopi bodies with nitya-siddha gopis having mahabhava, and by seeing, hearing, remembering and chanting about the qualities of the Lord, they will certainly attain such a position. Because these methods are very powerful, without them one cannot attain perfection as a gopi.
He (Krsna) gives a spiritual gopi body endowed with proper bhavas, as he gave a spiritual body to Narada. Then, when Krsna and his associates appear in a manifest Vrndavana, that body is born in the womb of a gopi by the arrangement of yogamaya in order to perfect sneha and other varieties of prema. UN, 3.49-51 Commentary
Krsna “gives a spiritual gopi body,” … “as He gave a spiritual body to Narada.” Why does Krsna have to give a spiritual body if we already had one that was simply asleep? Krsna “gave” Narada a spiritual body – it doesn’t say that Krsna woke him up or showed him his original form that was dormant. Where are the verses which say that Krsna wakes up the devotee so they can see their original spiritual form? There are none.
And finally, Sanatana Gosvami comments in Brhad-bhagavatamrta:
A non devotee may ask, “Because devotional service is a type of activity and all activities are driven by ego, how can devotional service develop after ego has been left aside?” This question comes from a misunderstanding of the Supreme Lord’s personal energies. Just as one of His special energies provides liberated Vaisnavas with spiritual bodies, another gives them a transcendental ego, with the attitude that “I am His servant.” With this spiritual ego, pure devotional service is easily obtained. BB, 2.2.208 commentary
How can anyone possibly interpret these statements to support the argument that we fell from Vraja or Vaikuntha, and through bhakti, we’re simply waking up to resume our forgotten rasa with Krsna in our original spiritual bodies, which already exist? It cannot be done.
We cannot resolve this issue by limiting our study to Srila Prabhupada’s statements only, while ignoring the statements of the acaryas as presented above. Any authoritative analysis must include the entire body of Gaudiya Vaisnava literature. Therefore, those who assert the fall theory must explain all of the statements presented herein to prove that they confirm their theory.
According to the parampara protocol, we are obligated to defer to the collective, unified consensus presented by all of the previous acaryas, and resolve Srila Prabhupada’s statements according to their conclusions. Twisting Srila Prabhupada’s statements to force them to prove that the jivas fell from Krsna’s lila, against an overwhelming abundance of contrary evidence is a futile exercise, as examining any of the weak contrary arguments will easily reveal.
What is the purpose of trying to prove that Srila Prabhupada said something so contradictory to the previous acaryas? Their numerous statements are clear and indisputable, and there is not one single statement that supports the “fall from the lila” side of this debate. To maintain and promote that Srila Prabhupada established this false concept is not loyalty to Srila Prabhupada, it is guru-aparadha because it is a serious distortion of his statements and Vaisnava siddhanta. It reveals a complete lack of understanding of this crucial philosophical subject. It should be rejected by all of his disciples and followers.