Dear Uttamasloka Prabhu,
Your arrogance is quite staggering but not surprising...
Its not surprising because the real symptom of a devotee; HUMBLENESS; is a rarity...
Since I can't sink myself to your level, I won't be ranting out in the manner you are habituated to do.
Only would like to request you to maintain a basic civic decency while interacting with someone.
Anyway, whats the story with "Vedic Cosmology"
And when did I sent you an email??? You seem to be delusional... Are you on some kind of medication???
I am most certainly not SWAMI GAURANGAPADA (whoever that fellow is)...
You seem to be overly interested in knowing who I am...
So I will not leave your desire unfulfilled...
My name is KrishnaDas... I am a disciple of His Holiness Swaroop Damodar Maharaj...
I will complete 78 years this december... Hope this much information about me will suffice for now...
In anticipation of your further question, as to how did I end-up on your forum, here is how it happened...
My Guru-Maharaj has extensively spoken and written about the Raganuga Bhakti...
So we disciples naturally are inclined towards such topics...
While searching something regarding that, your forum link happened to be there in google...
Out of interest I clicked there and then one thing lead to another and I downloaded you 44 page book from your TINYURL...
After reading that book I felt pitiful about your understanding of this topic... (but now after interacting with you... I am not surprised)
Thus out of compassion I decided to ask you few questions knowing full well that your poor understanding of this topic won't stand the test of even couple of my questions...
And, as expected, it didn't...
What I didn't expect though, was this kind of arrogance... This behaviour of yours only demonstrates your neophyte level of Bhakti... Still you have the audacity to present yourself as some kind of authority in these advanced topics...
If you have any courage, then you will not delete this post... Because now, for your benefit and for the benefit of current and future vistors to your forum, I would like to present Srila Prabhupada's take on this JIVA FALL TOPIC... Unlike you I won't be manufacturing any conclusions or giving some illogical and non-sensible assertions... This will be a SAAR (essence) of what Srila Prabhupada's thoughts are about this topic... Thus I won't be wasting readers time in refernces. I am sure if a reader reads Srila Prabhupada's books faithfully, he will come to understand that this is what Srila Prabhupada's take is, on this topic.
We don't need to go beyond Srila Prabhupada's books to understand this topic or any topic regarding Krishna Bhakti, for that matter.
SO HERE COMES A HOLISTIC UNDERSTANDING OF THE JIVA FALL TOPIC... LET READERS JUDGE WHETHER THE FOLLOWING LINES GIVE THEM PROPER UNDERSTANDING OR NOT...
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First of all there are THREE things that we need to be aware of:
1. There are expansions of Krishna
2. There are expansions of Krishna's HLADINI Shakti (i.e: expansions of Radha Rani)
3. And then there are expansions of TATASTHA Shakti (i.e: ALL THE JIVAs)
THERE ARE NO TWO TYPES OF JIVAs... All JIVAs are an expansion of TATASTHA Shakti...
At the beginning... (I use this word BEGINNING hesitantly, because ETERNAL and BEGINNING are mutually exclusive words. But since at somepoint Krishna must have expanded into Baladev Prabhu in order for Baladev Prabhu to manifest everything there is... So even in this ETERNAL TIME there must have been a BEGINNING)...
So at the beginning, there was only Krishna and nothing else... We JIVAs were as individual particles residing in the SAT-CIT-ANANDA Vigraha of Sri Krishna...
Srila Prabhupada tells us that; Just as a drop of ocean water possesses all the qualities of ocean and only differs in quantity; the same way we have all the qualities of Krishna while we differ in the ability or capability... Krishna is UNLIMITEDLY CAPABLE and we are COMPLETELY INCAPABLE...
Thats what makes Krishna Supremely independent and we JIVAs are completely dependent on HIM...
Krishna has a quality wherein HE DESIRES to SERVE... Similarly HE also has a quality wherein HE DESIRES to CONTROL...
Since Krishna has both these qualities... So we JIVAs also possess the desire to serve and the desire to control...
Only problem is, we are incapable to fulfill our desires without the help of Krishna...
So while we were in Krishna's Vigraha, Krishna being OMNISCIENT, could realize that HIS PARTS and PARCELS (that would be US JIVAs) have desires.
Since HE had given us FREE WILL, from which DESIRES CAN SPROUT, HE felt, HE should fulfill our desires... (It is of no use to have free will, if the desires sprouting from that free will can't be fulfilled)
Some of the JIVAs were overwhelmed by the DESIRE TO SERVE... While some others were overpowered by the DESIRE TO CONTROL... While others couldn't make up there mind (so to speak, and thus remained UNDECIDED)...
In order to fulfill the desire of HIS beloved parts and parcels, Krishna manifested his first expansion as Baladev Prabhu...
All the JIVAs were transfered under the shelter of this first expansion...
Then Baladev Prabhu manifested the spiritual world and all those JIVAs who were inclined to SERVE, appeared from Baladev Prabhu into that spiritual world... These JIVAs engaged in serving Krishna in one of the FOUR PRIMARY RASAs (ie: Dasya, Sakhya, Vatsalya and Madhurya).
Then Baladev Prabhu had further expansions culminating into the expansion of Maha-Vishna...
The JIVAs who desired to be CONTROLLERS and the ones who were UNDECIDED were transfered into the Vigraha of Maha-Vishnu...
The JIVAs who were UNDECIDED merged into the Brahmajyoti effulgence and are said to be in SHANTA RASA... (more on this later)
For the JIVAs who wanted to be CONTROLLERS they were segregated and then transfered into innumerable GARBHODAKASHAYI VISHNU expansions... There is one GARBHODAKASHAYI VISHNU expansion, for each universe in this material world. The JIVAs were then embodied by the combination of THREE GUNAS (SATVA, RAJAS, TAMAS) to correspond there desire to LORD IT OVER (Control). This populating of universe is done through the SPECIAL EXPANSION OF SHIVA TATVA... SHIVA is not in VISHUDDHA-SATVA instead is a transformation of Krishna... Thus Shiva Tatva is niether a part of Spiritual Sky, nor a part of Material Sky. Thus it is called a special transformation. This Shiva Tatva is the one that directly interacts with the INFERIOR ENERGY (MAYA SHAKTI) in the form of BHAVANI or PARVATI. Thus from the agency of Shiva and Parvati this universe is populated with JIVAs provided by GARBHODAKASHAYI VISHNU...
Therefore in this world Shiva and Parvati are worshipped in their LINGA (male and female genital organs) form, since they are the primary progenitors of the universe.
Exception to this rule is the JIVA who becomes Bramha of the Universe. This JIVA is fortuante to be called SWAYAMBHU (without a material Father or Mother) since he is directly embodied through the agency of GARBHODAKASHAYI VISHNU...
SO, AS MENTIONED ABOVE, ALL THE JIVAs EXERCISE THERE FREE-WILL WHILE IN THE VIGRAHA OF KRISHNA... AND WHERE KRISHNA IS, THAT PLACE CAN BE CONSIDERED AS SPIRITUAL WORLD... SO ESSENTIALLY ALL THE JIVAs HAVE COME FROM THE SPIRITUAL WORLD... THUS SRILA PRABHUPADA ALWAYS SAID "BACK TO GODHEAD"... YOU CAN'T GO BACK UNLESS YOU CAME FROM THAT PLACE...
So as far as coming from the NITYA-LEELA is concerned... The answer is NO... The JIVAs took the decision before entering the Nitya-Leela, and then were placed in Spiritual or Material worlds based on the JIVAs decision...
BUT NECESSARILY, THE DECISION WAS THAT OF THE JIVAs AND IT WAS NECESSARILY MADE IN THE SPIRITUAL WORLD... NOT IN THE VIRAJA RIVER IN MAHA-VISHNU's VIGRAHA...
THERE ARE NO TWO TYPES OF JIVAs... THERE IS ONLY ONE... AND THEY ARE ALL EXPANSIONS OF TATASTHA SHAKTI... THEY ALL HAVE FREE WILL... SO TECHNICALLY THEY CAN IN ALL ETERNITY DECIDE TO SERVE OR CONTROL... THAT OPTION IS ALWAYS THERE...
Now, as far the JIVAs which are inclined to SERVE from the beginning are concerned, they are highly unlikely to develop the ENJOYER or CONTROLLER tendency... (Although we know that Sridam once wanted to be with Tulasi and thus Krishna arranged for both of them to be cursed by Srimati Radha Rani after which they took birth in this material world as Tulasi and Shankhachuda... That is in the SALIGRAM LEELA)... So we can understand that JIVA is always free to exercise his free-will, anytime, whether he is in Nitya-Leela or not... Tulasi and Sridam returned to Goloka after the SALIGRAM LEELA and during that LEELA both had full remembrance of their identities in Nitya-Leela of Goloka...
So when us, JIVAs from this material world purify our desires, which means we DESIRE to SERVE rather than to CONTROL, then we will be eligible to be transfered to the Spiritual World through the agency of Baladev Prabhu...
As Srila Prabhupada says, we will remember our stay in the Material World as a Bad Dream... And as someone who has a Bad Dream is reluctant to go back to sleep, to avoid that dream, much in the same way Prabhupada says, we will avoid the tendency to CONTROL... Thus it will be unlikely (althought totally possible) that we will come back here again from the Spiritual World...
Hope this helps the readers in one way or other...
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Hare Krishna
(Uttamasloka Prabhu, Please don't bother to reply to this post, IF ALL YOU HAVE IS RANTING... We all know you are very good at that... We don't need one more demonstration of the same "STRAWMAN-ARGUMENT" accusation. It is getting very repetitive.)